Experience with FermCap?

[Joerg]

After brewing my 2nd Belgian Tripel a week ago I had an even "louder"
kraeusen blow-off than during my 1st. BE-256 yeast going nuclear. This
time I had a 3/8" blow-off hose into a 1-gal milk jug half-filled with
StarSan solution. It still lifted the otherwise hard-to-pry lid of the
bucket, opposite the side where the blow-off tapped in. Wild burping in
the middle of the night along with evil hissing and liquid oozing down
the sides of the fermenter. Of course, I had learned my lesson and
placed it on a tiled surface in an area where even a grenading lid would
not trigger a major remodeling effort.

A brewpub owner recommended FermCap:

http://www.northernbrewer.com/fermcap-s-1-oz

Questions:

1. Will this make the trub unsafe for consumption? Aside from harvesting
yeast we use all of the remaining trub to make bread. So the FermCap
drops will be in there.

2. What is the shelf life of this stuff? I would only need it on
high-alcohol Belgian brews.

Two days later I dared to move it into the fermentation chamber:

Loading Image...

Behind it is a Superior Strong Ale in primary. Brewed same day, regular
US-05 yeast, no Belgian candi sugar, very behaved in fermentation. In
the chamber below are two secondary fermenters with Pale Ale and IPA and
the heater module in front. It is a former wine fridge modified to be
able to heat and cool, with the bottom half being colder for secondary
fermentation and resting.

[Howard .]

Post by Joerg
After brewing my 2nd Belgian Tripel a week ago I had an even "louder"
kraeusen blow-off than during my 1st. BE-256 yeast going nuclear. This
time I had a 3/8" blow-off hose into a 1-gal milk jug half-filled with
StarSan solution. It still lifted the otherwise hard-to-pry lid of the
bucket, opposite the side where the blow-off tapped in. Wild burping in
the middle of the night along with evil hissing and liquid oozing down
the sides of the fermenter. Of course, I had learned my lesson and
placed it on a tiled surface in an area where even a grenading lid would
not trigger a major remodeling effort.
http://www.northernbrewer.com/fermcap-s-1-oz

I've never used it, but this looks to be a good review of it:

http://brulosophy.com/2014/10/02/fermcap-s-the-magical-cure-for-
boilovers/

It's mostly about using it in the boil, but there's a brief reference to
fermenting -- he says it has an effect but not as much as during the
boil.

He also references an FDA recommendation that beer using it gets
filtered, although FDA recommendations tend to be very stringent since
they're looking from a universal perspective. He says it's similar to
what is in Gas-X, an anti-flatuence medication that is sold over the
counter in the US, which gives another perspective on its safety,
although I don't know how the concentrations and volumes consumed would
compare between beer and the medication. He also cites others who say
at the concentrations used, it's not a problem.

I'd personally be a bit more cautious about using it during fermentation
since that is a less active process that may or may not mix it as well
into solution. Less from a personal health perspective and more
regarding potential effects on the beer, especially the head. Also,
since you reuse the trub for bread, it's possible that residual amounts
may cause issues with the structure of the dough, but I don't know as
far as the amounts used.

Personally, I'd suggest getting a gallon jug as a mini fermenter and
running a test before using it on a full batch. If you're using it for
Belgians, it's a good way to make a starter for liquid yeast anyways,
and for Belgians liquid yeasts tend to give more interesting results
than dry.

It's also worth googling online yeast calculators to figure out a good
pitching rate. I haven't used them much, but I would assume that they
can help dial in good amounts of yeast to use limit explosive foaming,
and that may solve the problem. I think pitching rates tend to matter
more for Belgians anyways, since over and underpitching tends to have a
more significant influence on the flavor and aromas you get from more
quirky yeasts.

[Joerg]

Post by Howard .

Post by Joerg
After brewing my 2nd Belgian Tripel a week ago I had an even "louder"
kraeusen blow-off than during my 1st. BE-256 yeast going nuclear. This
time I had a 3/8" blow-off hose into a 1-gal milk jug half-filled with
StarSan solution. It still lifted the otherwise hard-to-pry lid of the
bucket, opposite the side where the blow-off tapped in. Wild burping

in

Post by Joerg
the middle of the night along with evil hissing and liquid oozing down
the sides of the fermenter. Of course, I had learned my lesson and
placed it on a tiled surface in an area where even a grenading lid

would

Post by Joerg
not trigger a major remodeling effort.
http://www.northernbrewer.com/fermcap-s-1-oz

http://brulosophy.com/2014/10/02/fermcap-s-the-magical-cure-for-
boilovers/
It's mostly about using it in the boil, but there's a brief reference to
fermenting -- he says it has an effect but not as much as during the
boil.

The boil is the least of my worries because I only have two 1kW burners
under the pot which makes things very slow. Also, it is a 13-gal pot
with about 5-3/4 pre-boil volume in there so the risk of a boil-over is low.

Post by Howard .
He also references an FDA recommendation that beer using it gets
filtered, although FDA recommendations tend to be very stringent since
they're looking from a universal perspective. He says it's similar to
what is in Gas-X, an anti-flatuence medication that is sold over the
counter in the US, which gives another perspective on its safety,
although I don't know how the concentrations and volumes consumed would
compare between beer and the medication. He also cites others who say
at the concentrations used, it's not a problem.
I'd personally be a bit more cautious about using it during fermentation
since that is a less active process that may or may not mix it as well
into solution.

I could add it while racking from the boil pot. I made myself a
contraption that causes lots of splashing for good aeration and this
would also cause good mixing. Which always made me wonder why we brewers
don't already pitch dry yeast after the first half or full gallon has
poured in. Later when the whole five gallons are in I always have to
rake the foam to the side so the yeast won't just ride on the foam.
Unless pitching harvested yeast which is liquid and thus sploshes in.

Post by Howard .
... Less from a personal health perspective and more
regarding potential effects on the beer, especially the head. Also,
since you reuse the trub for bread, it's possible that residual amounts
may cause issues with the structure of the dough, but I don't know as
far as the amounts used.

That could be a problem because I really want that starter dough to
raise to at least 2x in volume.

Post by Howard .
Personally, I'd suggest getting a gallon jug as a mini fermenter and
running a test before using it on a full batch. If you're using it for
Belgians, it's a good way to make a starter for liquid yeast anyways,
and for Belgians liquid yeasts tend to give more interesting results
than dry.

Good idea. I always sprinkled dry Fermentis BE-256. Could make a starter
from that as well. But my concern is that it becomes even more nuclear
if I do. That is because whenever I use yeast harvested from trub for
other beers the fermentation starts in less than half the usual time and
is more vigorous than with dry yeast. More vigorous is the last thing I
want with the Belgian Tripel.

Post by Howard .
It's also worth googling online yeast calculators to figure out a good
pitching rate. I haven't used them much, but I would assume that they
can help dial in good amounts of yeast to use limit explosive foaming,
and that may solve the problem. I think pitching rates tend to matter
more for Belgians anyways, since over and underpitching tends to have a
more significant influence on the flavor and aromas you get from more
quirky yeasts.

Yes, good point. So far I took the whole package because the recipe said
so, sanitized it, cut the pouch and sprinkled it onto the wort surface
while gentling spooning aside the aeration foam.